Wednesday, November 22, 2006

Waiting for Motor, Inverter to arrive!

I've ordered a MES-DEA system, 30kW continuous, 90kW max power (about 100hp+ or so).

Waiting for it to arrive, wish it wouldn't take so long. :) I feel like a kid waiting for a toy to arrive. Trying to come up with the battery system now in the meantime.

Been reading up on EV conversions, and the pro's and con's (look at FAQ #6) of auto versus manual transmission, and I've decided to stick with a manual, but without a clutch. Supposedly you don't need a clutch? I'm still not quit sure how it all works, though, so I'm going to keep the clutch and clutch pedal and just not use it. Going to remove the flywheel for reducing rotational mass, which I think is ok.

Added the car to evalbum.


Shaun Williams said...

Hi Tony,

Nice to see you Blogging your conversion. Sounds like it's going to be a really great project.

I know my conversion is DC but I would hate NOT to have a clutch. It makes the vehicle so much more drivable for you and OTHERS. It's only a tiny bit harder to incorporate the clutch and then if you choose not to use it you don't have to!

I think I remember Don Cameron mentioning on the EV List he'd wished he'd kept the clutch on his New Beetle conversion.

Anyhow, have fun!

johng said...


If you have no flywheel, you have no clutch. With AC this is typically no problem at all as the AC motors have more than enough RPM to use a single gear. Use the lowest gear you can while keeping a reasonable top speed with the battery pack at 50% DOD.

Clutchless shifting of a typical manual transmission is a VERY bad thing. The parts inside the trans are not designed for this. Sure, the gears will not "clash" or "grind" at first... but the parts that keep this from happening (called synchronyzers) will quickly wear out when used w/o a clutch. There should be no NEED to shift, so after it is completed you can remove the shifter, clutch and associated parts if desired.

Anonymous said...

Quote: "Clutchless shifting of a typical manual transmission is a VERY bad thing. The parts inside the trans are not designed for this. Sure, the gears will not "clash" or "grind" at first... but the parts that keep this from happening (called synchronyzers) will quickly wear out when used w/o a clutch."

Ummmm... This may be off subject since we are talking about a EV conversion, but I just gotta say this person should be more selective of how he words things, unless he really is this misinformed.
Sure, if you don't know what you are doing and you're not careful, you WILL wear out and damage a manual transmission by shifting without a clutch. If you don't pull it out of gear far enough for the next one, you could foul up the syncronizers and grind your gears, not a good thing. If you force it into gear too hard without waiting for it to "fall into gear" then you can damage your syncronizers. learning to drive a manual transmission without a clutch is at best risky in the beginning, but if you master it, it will save you a lot of money. First, figuring you are in fact doing it properly, you will never have to change out a clutch again or do any non-routine maintenance to your transmission. You will also get better gas mileage and save wear and tear on your engine because performing this skill successfully, requires one to become "tuned" to how the engine and transmission are working together and work WITH them, not against them. Most people that use clutches drop in gear with the engine RPM's significantly lower or higher than what they should be for the gear and speed. This causes a "jump" and jarr's the power train, it causes excessive wear on mounts and the clutch assembly.

Don't believe what I'm talking about? Ask any semi trucker, we're talking about 10-18 speed manual transmissions here with powertrain lifetimes in excess of 600,000 miles...and most don't use clutch past 7'th gear (about what it takes to get up to 25 mph). Think those are different from cars and trucks? Only in scale, but same internal workings. Oh, and yes, I drive my Chevy S-10 5-speed without using the clutch once i've accelerated to 2nd gear. It's a 1992 2.8V6 with 175,000 miles on it, leaks no oil, has NEVER had any clutch replacement or transmission work and thanks in part to my clutchless shifting, achieves nearly 500 miles to a tank! (20gal total, approx 17 gal usuable) I think I'll just keep on saving wear and tear on my engine and transmission thank you.

Douglas Coleman said...

I have a 1988 Toyota MR2 with an Advanced DC 8 inch motor and have been driving it two years clutchless with zero problems. This setup doesn't even use a flywheel which reduces the spinning mass of the motor to a very low level so the syncros in the transmission have a much easier life than those in clutch vehicles with a large mass flywheel. I typically only use second gear in town but use all five when accelerating on the freeway (top Speed is over 70). Its a dream to drive. Only caveat is to get the adapter and coupler from a quality shop that has experience with these. The alignment of these is just as critical as it is with the clutch version. Happy shifting.

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